[Church_of_Christ] Re: Creeds
Brother Cole:
I found this article just a few moments ago.
Make me feel better? No not really, my faith is in the "word" and not men BUT it seems there are others that are as warped as I am. lol
" The formulation "one god in three person" was not solidly established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith, prior to the end of the 4th century. But it is precisely this formulation that has first claim to the title THE TRINITARIAN DOGMA. Among the Apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.
How about some scriptural proof? Obviously this is very important as the very argument is whether or not God's word truly teaches this. Matthew 26:39 - Here Jesus is praying to his father, almighty god. If they were not distinct individuals, such a prayer would be meaningless. Jesus also refered to being SENT by his Father. John 8:17,18. So he definately spoke about himself as being an individual separate from god.
Does the bible teach that none of those who are said to be included in the trinity is greater or less than another, that all are equal, that all are almighty?
Mark 13:32: Of that day or that hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the son, but only the Father."(Of course that would not be the case if Father, Son, and Holy Spirit were coequal, comprising one Godhead. And if, as some suggest, the Son was limited by his human nature from knowing, the question remains, WHY DID THE HOLY SPIRIT NOT KNOW?
Because the Holy Spirit is not a person, it is Gods active force. Some say, but why is the Holy Spirit described LIKE a person, a "helper" that "teaches, "speaks, "hears"? But some scriptures say people were filled with Holy Spirit, can you be filled with someone? To understand what the Bible as a WHOLE teaches, ALL texts must be considered. What is the reasonable conclusion about the Holy Spirit?That the texts employ a figure of speech personifying God's Holy Spirit, his active Force as the bible also personifies wisdom, sin, death, water and blood. For example Luke 7:35 Jesus says wisdom has Children, but wisdom isn't a person!
The New Catholic Encyclopedia admits: The majority of New Testament texts reveal God's spirit as SOMETHING, not SOMEONE; this is especially seen in the parrallelism between the spirit and the power of God" (1967), Vol. XIII, p.575
So the Holy Spirit is God's active force, his power he uses to fulfill his purposes, Gods son is Jesus Christ. So who is almighty God?
Psalms 83:18: "That people may know, you whose name is JEHOVAH, you ALONE are the most High" Jehovah is Almighty God. The bible tells us his personality, the fact that he created his son "the firstborn of all creation" Jesus, who helped him with his creative works. The holy spirit is what helped them to do that, it was the power of it which enabled creation. Genesis 1:2(b) :" and God's active force was moving to and fro over the surface of the water" Active force in Hebrew is translated RU'ACH, which means Spirit. Genesis 1:26 " And God went on to say: " Let US make man in our image." US - Jehovah and Jesus. Talking to each other. Simple.
--- In Church_of_Christ@
>
>
> Bro Cole said to Ed:
>
> Ed, I'm going out on a limb here and speculating that you've never
> really been associated with a congregational creed before. Because what
> you are describing here about creeds is completely foreign to by
> understanding and experiences. So are you saying that a creed will force
> an understanding or misunderstanding of the Trinity??? [:-s]
>
> Clay's response:
>
> There is not a trinity Bro Cole made up of 3 equals. [[-(]
>
> There are 2 equals, God the Father and God the Son and it is their Holy
> spirit that indwells us and NOT a 3rd equal.
>
> Want to know when I decided this truth?
>
> When I read the text for myself, over and over and over until I was
> consumed with the "word"
>
> When I wasn't reading the text I was listening to it on cassett tape in
> my truck that I drove for a living gor 13 years.
>
> Know when it hit me Bro Cole?
>
> I was speaking with our pulpit preacher and it just came out in my
> conversation and I was simi shocked.
>
> I thought back and wondered, where did this revelation come from. When
> did I first learn it.
>
> The whole of the NT has a theme a message that is LOST and DISTORTED by
> uninspired men.
>
> We worry way too much what Bro Soandso "thinks" we should believe about
> the text.
>
> Well Clay he is much "studied"
>
> My question is, So what? I hope he is comfortable to face the Lord with
> His studies, for I am equally confident in "listening" to the Spirit
> through the inspired word.
>
> Grace and peace my Brother, Clay
>
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